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Post by justwannano on Sept 18, 2009 13:29:12 GMT -6
I looked into a carry permit today. I'm constantly forgetting to take it off before i get into the truck. I'm thinking it would be better to get the permit than take anymore chances of getting into trouble if I get stopped sometime and have a pistol strapped on. Anyway the lady at the sheriffs office told me he doesn't issue permits for hunting. I didn't want to explain to her I wasn't hunting with it I was trapping. Years ago when I was trapping I knew most of the deputies or they knew me but now most everyone on the force is so much younger and I haven't had a job where I was well known for many years. It probably would have been overlooked back then but things have changed. So would someone who has recently gotten a permit please pm me. Or maybe some of you old timers who are in the know. Thanks have a good 1 just
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Post by iowatrapper on Sept 18, 2009 14:30:37 GMT -6
So say for personal protection and then use it for anything that you want, dont you want it for protection as well anyways?
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Post by Scott W. on Sept 18, 2009 14:45:49 GMT -6
Here's the problem with the law in Iowa as it stands today. A sheriff "may" issue at his discretion. He doesn't have to. We need the law to say "shall" issue.
My sheriff said he would not issue one for personal protection, one for hunting and trapping was no problem. It is even stated as such on the permit. I just got mine this summer, so this is current information for Howard county. I cannot carry it concealed when I am not trapping. Go figure. Scott
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Post by hvtrapper on Sept 18, 2009 15:08:12 GMT -6
My permit reason for issuance is; Demonstrated Responsibility I had to write a letter to the Scott Co. sheriff listing my qualifications, training, experience to be accepted for the permit program.
Tom
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mrvic
Shy Talker
Posts: 12
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Post by mrvic on Sept 18, 2009 17:20:34 GMT -6
I know in Jefferson County they won't hand them out either for any reason. About got caught carrying in shoulder holster as i too forgot after carrying it all day in the woods. Needs to be a state wide reg that sheriffs give out but can't make the decisions. Kind of like a few deciding if gays can marry here in Iowa... should be a people vote... (Nothing agaisn't Gays)
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Post by Scott W. on Sept 18, 2009 18:24:53 GMT -6
Tom, How long ago did you get yours? And if it has been a while, have you had it renewed under different sheriffs?
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Post by bigtimebowfishing on Sept 18, 2009 19:21:59 GMT -6
look on the bright side at least you guys got a chance at getting one our great governor says nobody get a ccp in wisconsin i'm so glad he isn't running next year....
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Post by k9 on Sept 18, 2009 19:30:16 GMT -6
See if you can get it for personal protection as mentioned earlier. I think the trapping restriction is BS. If you are qualified to carry for that then you should be eligible to carry anytime. I always tell friends to go for personal protection.
That being said some Sheriffs just will not issue. Do what you can to change thier minds or get them out of office.
I disagree with the "shall" issue language. It needs to be the discretion of the Sheriff or taken away completely. Most people fail to consider that when a Sheriff signs a permit he then becomes liable for your actions. You cannot force him to sign all permits with "shall" language because he might have someone come in that just flat out shouldn't have one but would quailfy to have one without the Sheriff's discretion. Take away teh Sheriff's liability and I can go along with issuing to all who are not substance abusers or criminals.
I think it would be better if the State issued permits to all who applied so that the Sheriff has no liability. BUT, that permit comes with the understanding that a Sheriff can revoke it at any time if he sees it as neccessary, with no explanation to the permit holder.
This would take away the Sheriff's liability. This would allow all to have a permit that wants one. This would keep the permit holders in line as they will not want to lose it. This would keep the Sheriff's in line because there is a big difference between refusing to issue to all your constiuents, compared to taking all of them away after the contituents have already gotten them.
THAT type of action could get a Sheriff beaten in an election.
Fella stopped by my house one time. Heck of a nice guy, a little quirky I always thought but decent fellow. No criminal history.
He wanted to talk to me about his role in a top secret government intelligence organization called "Black Ops". He handed me a business card that was very poorly made on his computer identifying him as an agent. He told me he knows I keep secrets for a living and was trusting me with his secret. The reason he shared all this with me is because he wanted me to assist him with a "mission" of highest secrecy. He knows I have access to criminal histories and the like, and wanted me to run a history on a guy he knew to see if that person could be qualified to be involved in his "business". Of course I will not run a history for him that would be wrong. By the time he left my house I was shocked and taken aback by what a nut job this guy really is. He always came off so decent.
I was talking with the Sheriff a few days after that and found out that this guy was in the process of getting a carry permit. I nuked that process without hesitation. The Sheriff was shocked too because this guy comes off so nice.
Do you really want a guy who thinks he is a secret agent for a top secret "Black Ops" group that answers directly to the President to be packing concealed? This is the type of thing that the Sheriff's discretion comes in handy for.
Again my recipe for this is State issues permits to all that want them, Sheriff is made aware who has permits.
Sheriff is given the dicretion to take away permit
Sheriff is forced to be reasonable by the fact that if he "takes away" a large number of permits that have been issued it will effect him politically
Permit holders are forced to be reasonable by the fact that if they abuse the permit the Sheriff will take it away
This is not doable, but the best solution to the problem.
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mrvic
Shy Talker
Posts: 12
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Post by mrvic on Sept 18, 2009 20:12:43 GMT -6
:)Now thank you for explaining that. Makes alot of sense to me. And a great idea.
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Post by Scott W. on Sept 18, 2009 20:20:43 GMT -6
You're right K9, the "shall issue" language should be designed to eliminate the sheriff's liability. I guess when the person who taught the class that I attended (Rob Boots) recommends "shall issue" language, I listen. Scott
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Post by justwannano on Sept 18, 2009 21:16:19 GMT -6
Thanks guys I hesitated at the personal protection because I don't feel threatened. I also don't have to carry weekend cash to the bank anymore. I guess, if thats what i have to say ... Have a good 1 just
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Post by k9 on Sept 18, 2009 21:44:21 GMT -6
I also never understood the "carries cash" reason either. A normal citizen should not have to give any reason other than it is his second amendment right.
Take the class to show proficiency and assure that they understand carrying responsibly, and send them on thier way.
I further do not understand why they need to renew each year, other than to show that they are still in the area.
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code
Hyper-Active Trap Talker
Posts: 175
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Post by code on Sept 18, 2009 22:00:11 GMT -6
That's a good theory K9, but too many would get re-elected just cause of the ticket they run. The sheriff shouldn't be liable for someone who passes the background check and completes the cwp class just cause the person does something stupid, they will do it with or without the permit. Shall issue is a must for the entire country, but if the sherriff knows the guy's a nut job, then he should have the power to refuse him. If he refuses too many then he should be removed from office for abuse of powers, not by vote. There is a group iowacarry.org, I belong to and is full of info and sends regular e-mail updates as needed and quite often.
Cody
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Post by hvtrapper on Sept 19, 2009 4:02:52 GMT -6
Scott, I just got a new permit in January '09 and haven't had to renew yet. I've had permits in Black Hawk, Dubuque, Appanoose and Scott counties in the past. The first Scott county permit was issued in '87. I was told at the time (Sheriff Ashcroft) that I was only getting it because of the permit from Appanoose county I held and it would not be renewed. I requested a permit each time a new sheriff was elected and was refused on the grounds that "no one" was issued a cwp. Sheriff Conard decided to start issuing permits under the demonstrated responsibility cause a while ago, but this was the first time I could work the required class into my schedule. This was the second time through for me as I took the class the first time it was required back in the 70's. No class room required when I moved to Dubuque in '80, but I was required to range qualify there. No requirements in Appanoose and the first permit in Scott county. The sheriff's just signed off, I paid the fees and a permit was issued. The tricky part where I live now is traveling back and forth from IL. NO carry there and serious restrictions on transporting any firearm, so I have to be very aware of what's in the truck all of the time. Tom
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Post by roosterk0031 on Sept 24, 2009 12:39:12 GMT -6
Check out Iowacarry.org forums and you should be able to find what the Sheriff in Henry county does or doesn't not accept for a reason.
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Post by x-demoman on Sept 24, 2009 20:15:03 GMT -6
Got my permit to carry in the first class in Adair Co. Reason: carry articles of considerable value. Been through 3 different sheriffs and never had a problem or been questioned at renewal time.
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Post by justwannano on Sept 24, 2009 22:23:18 GMT -6
Check out Iowacarry.org forums and you should be able to find what the Sheriff in Henry county does or doesn't not accept for a reason. Thanks for the info. The forums don't include Henry County. Guess I'm on my own. Thanks for the info guys Have a good 1 just
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Post by stomper on Sept 26, 2009 13:37:55 GMT -6
I live in Dubuque county. I know they say forget trying to get one here but. Anyone know the requirements to carry. Or what do you people think the requirements should be. Qualify at a range and a set number of hours of class? What ever.
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Post by k9 on Sept 26, 2009 19:33:51 GMT -6
The requirement SHOULD be you are a law abiding citizen, with no substance abuse or mental health issues. A class to make sure you can hit what you are shooting at and understand use of force etc.
Thats what it SHOULD be.
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Post by justwannano on Sept 26, 2009 19:53:29 GMT -6
The form asks you all the normal stuff.--name- address- birth date etc.etc.etc. On the back side Have you ever been convicted of a felony?domestic abuse,assault-hate crime,asault on police officer etc.hazing stalking controlled substance acts of violence adjudged mentally incompetent? Are you an american citizen Statement of justification-----This here is the kicker Justify why you are wanting it. ?WTF I have been told DO NOT USE PERSONAL PROTECTION as a justification. He won't issue it. I can only find 1 guy who has been issued a permit who isn't a cop. His was issued by the previous sherriff. He says make it have something to do with work. The Sheriff is supposed to be calling me. He called last night but we wern't home. Spent all day hanging around home waiting. I figured I just as well ask him what he wants. I Don't know. 99 different Sheriffs. 99 diferent criteria. Have a good 1 just
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Post by hvtrapper on Sept 27, 2009 5:24:48 GMT -6
Hey Just, Ask your sheriff if you can use "demonstrated responsibility" for a reason. That's about the only reason Scott county sheriff will allow for a non-professional cwp. Tom
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