|
|
Post by ~ADC~ on Feb 25, 2009 7:22:46 GMT -6
Why do you pre-stake or why do you not?
I'd like to hear the motivation behind it.
~ADC~
|
|
|
|
Post by Brett H. on Feb 25, 2009 8:04:53 GMT -6
I do because I am a full time college student and also work part time so I try to use as much free time before season to prepair so when season starts I can use my limited time just removing coon from the traps!
|
|
|
|
Post by Scott W. on Feb 25, 2009 8:32:28 GMT -6
I do not (or did not this season) because it never entered my mind to do it on private or public land, and I didn't know it was legal. I plan on using the method next season.
In the old days I would have been too paranoid about theft. Heck it was tough enough during the active season.
Glad to see a more ethical brand of trapper on this site. Hope we can spread the good attitude. Scott
|
|
|
|
Post by jdrogge on Feb 25, 2009 9:16:08 GMT -6
I have a very limited amount of time to trap each year and I like to run a very large line. Prestaking allows me to get the majority if not all of my line operational from day one, instead of taking a few days to get it all up and running. Prestaking is just another tool, but it is one that allows me to see the full potential of my line in the limited time that I have to trap. According to some on this site prestakers are just "greedy" a##holes who are trying to bully the "little guy" what a bunch of crap. Everyone sets their line out with the intention of making the best catch that they can, for someone who puts more time and effort into their line to be labeled as greedy because they outperform another trapper is complete BS.
|
|
|
|
Post by centraliowa (ryan) on Feb 25, 2009 9:22:30 GMT -6
i pre-stake, so i can get all my water traps in and have as many days as possible before freeze up. If i wait until 8am to start i would be putting in traps until Monday and then only have 10 maybe 15 days until freeze. Pre-staking gives me an additional 2 days of having a full line out. I still run alot of traps after the slow water moving area's freeze but the catch goes way down.
|
|
|
|
Post by skunked on Feb 25, 2009 9:44:34 GMT -6
I hear from time to time the United States is slowly transforming from a democracy to socialism. I always saw their point but did not put much into it. If trapping organizations are taking socialistic actions then I better start paying attention. I figured they would be the last to go.
|
|
|
|
Post by BigT on Feb 25, 2009 11:11:24 GMT -6
I dont. Why catch poor coon on opening day when you can catch nice coon 2nd week of the season. Turns the same amount of work into triple the money. Why prestake? Take the 2nd week of the season off from work and do the staking during the 1st week. I personally think this whole prestaking this is a little over blown. I am a new trapper so maybe my views are skewed I dunno.
Tapping saeson opens on the 1st Saturday in November!!! 8:00 AM !!
|
|
|
|
Post by jdrogge on Feb 25, 2009 11:33:56 GMT -6
I can remember years where we were shut down due to weather by the second week of season, especially with a later start like next years Nov 7th. Weather is a gamble every year, but personally I'll be setting the first and second weeks of season to try and take advantage of hopefully nicer weather. There is also the fact in high competition areas you can't catch coon that were already put into someone elses truck during the first week.
|
|
|
|
Post by centraliowa (ryan) on Feb 25, 2009 12:25:52 GMT -6
BigT, the iowa coon are not poor the first week of the season. sure there are the smalls and dinks that will never be good, but anything else will be good. i also view prestaking as pre season work. do you do any preseason work? i will not start setting traps until 8am just like every other trapper.
|
|
|
|
Post by Brett H. on Feb 25, 2009 13:57:08 GMT -6
I dont. Why catch poor coon on opening day when you can catch nice coon 2nd week of the season. Turns the same amount of work into triple the money. Why prestake? Take the 2nd week of the season off from work and do the staking during the 1st week. I personally think this whole prestaking this is a little over blown. I am a new trapper so maybe my views are skewed I dunno. Tapping saeson opens on the 1st Saturday in November!!! 8:00 AM !! If you are looking at it in making more money then why dont you pre-stake before season and run those traps in the time that you would be pre-staking durning week 1? and catch that many more coon! then when the second week comes you still take off work and catch just as many coon in week 2 as you normally would! You will not run out of coon!! you jsut ahve to find more locations!! EXAMPLE: if you catch 250 coon the 2nd week and lets just say at a $14 Avg you make $3500!!(i dont think you will make TRIPLE your money from week one!! so i did DOUBLE and i still think that is a little high) ok now in your free time that you say you are pre-staking durning week 1 why dont you have some pre-staked before season so now you could use this time durning week 1 checking just a few traps and catching coon....lets say 75 coon at a $7 dollar avg =$525 ..... Just curious BIGT? ......I also do not beleive there is THAT much of a difference in the Iowa coon from week 1 to week 2!! and like this year..season will start on the 7th which would have been the 2nd week this past season....so y woudlnt you Pre-stake this year and catch those prime coon on the 7th? This past year i sold coon from the first second and third week... and the price did not change much.... NOT EVEN CLOSE TO TRIPLE!! Tapping saeson opens on the 1st Saturday in November!!! 8:00 AM !! I agree with this, that is why i do not set my first trap till 800 AM..... BUT prestaking my trap out is just PRESEASON WORK!!.... Everyone does pre-season work....dye,set pan tension,wax, add chain, add swivels, I think pre-staking is just another form of pre-season work! |
|
|
|
Post by x-demoman on Feb 25, 2009 15:59:24 GMT -6
I used to pre stake. Why?? to beat my compatition plain and simple. I don't know because I got tired of the pissin contests that no one could win.
The weather is a non issue, we have no control, live with it, fight it or stay home. The numbers we will or will not catch is also a non issue. There has not be 1/3 of the coon caught that were caught in the early 80s. Who puts the most coon into the overall catch in Iowa. Sorry guys its not the big boys but the little guys, sheer numbers with a few beats a few with alot everytime. This is taken from a survey the ITA did back in the late 70s-early 80s.
Gene
|
|
|
|
Post by BigT on Feb 25, 2009 16:55:38 GMT -6
How many traps do you usually set  My 1st day of coon trapping this last season I dug 180 pockets in an 10 hour period. Is 180 sets not enough to put in on opening day?? Day 2 start early and check day one sets and pound in another 120 sets. I started coon trapping November 9th last year. I did catch a couplke coons while rat trapping on the marsh the 1st week of saeson. These coons, even the big ones, were not near as good as the ones caught on my 1st coon line. 1st week of season we were seeing alot of $5.00 averages coon. My coons caught after Nov. 10th averaged $13.00. Almost triple!! |
|
|
|
Post by centraliowa (ryan) on Feb 25, 2009 17:21:33 GMT -6
the difference in price is prob because of the size. you catch a lot more smalls opening week that the 2nd week. the later in the season you go the bigger the coon get simply cause the young coon have been caught and the small one's prob died.
Gene, the survey from the 80's is not valid! do another survey.
|
|
|
|
Post by justwannano on Feb 25, 2009 17:34:01 GMT -6
How many traps do you usually set My 1st day of coon trapping this last season I dug 180 pockets in an 10 hour period. Is 180 sets not enough to put in on opening day?? Day 2 start early and check day one sets and pound in another 120 sets. I started coon trapping November 9th last year. I did catch a couplke coons while rat trapping on the marsh the 1st week of saeson. These coons, even the big ones, were not near as good as the ones caught on my 1st coon line. 1st week of season we were seeing alot of $5.00 averages coon. My coons caught after Nov. 10th averaged $13.00. Almost triple!! Hey T I don't know how old you are but I'll tell you for sure you won't be putting in 300 traps in 2 days when you are 62. Especially if you are road trapping. Most of the trappers I know are older guys. I haven't been back on the line long enough to talk to many of them, local fur buyer isn't in buisness anymore,but I'm sure they move a lot slower than you youngsters. We also have to keep in mind that a fall could not just be funny anymore. So moving fast just isn't a reality. But with some pre staking I can get out the traps that are necessary to complete my trapping loop. There is a lot of concern about prestaking not being fair for the young trappers but what about us older guys? I did "grow up " trapping road ditches. I feel I have more compassion for the new trapper than most on all the trapping sites I frequent. As far as prices you got for your coons: My coon sold for $8.00 for the first month. As far as waiting for coon to get fully prime: I really wish I had no competition like you. around here you snooze, you lose. Hope this explains why some of us feel prestaking is a pretty good tool that we don't want to lose. have a good one just |
|
|
|
Post by 4fur on Feb 25, 2009 17:39:56 GMT -6
Do not pay any attention to BigT because he's drunk again.  First of I'll be you 20 bucks that you will prestake next year BigT if it is still lawful. Second, everyone remembers you shooting your mouth off about the mink were prime, the coon were all 30# plus, the coon were all prime, blah, blah, blah when season first opened. And we remember how you didn't set coons up because you set rats up that first week. Actually it was about 4 days until you got "froze out" and pulled things. Then you were "so exhausted" you didn't get your coon line out until I had called you every girl name in the book and said you needed to install a tampon machine in your truck. Remember? Nov. 9th. How long did you run that line before you got froze out? Prestaking is probably essential in some years for a good catch in your area. Coon are ready in your area on day one, T. Especially when season opens the 8th. Heck, they're probably starting to rub by then that far north! I know your just trying to get a rise out of me and it worked! You see everyone, I talked to BigT-tard on the phone yesterday when he called me to kill time while driving to the airport. I told him the prestaking ban would actually help my catch come easier because the biggest number coon and mink guy traps through my area and he is all prestaked. Also said I was in no hurry to catch flat coon on Nov. 1 when I could wait a week and catch nicer coon. So he is just being a BigT-tard, T-tard for short!  |
|
264mag
Active Trap Talker
leon iowa
Posts: 84
|
Post by 264mag on Feb 25, 2009 19:16:09 GMT -6
Just started trapping again after 20 year. Didn't pre- stake back then or this year. Didn't realize it was legal to do. Knowing this now back then yes I would of pre-staked. This year ran 14 traps with 10 year old daughter so I would not of pre-staked. In the future I would pre-stake if we get to keep the right!
|
|
|
|
Post by iowatrapper on Feb 25, 2009 19:28:28 GMT -6
I have never pre-staked. I live and trap in 2 different places so I dont have much extra time.
|
|
|
|
Post by Brett H. on Feb 25, 2009 21:10:52 GMT -6
How many traps do you usually set My 1st day of coon trapping this last season I dug 180 pockets in an 10 hour period. Is 180 sets not enough to put in on opening day?? Day 2 start early and check day one sets and pound in another 120 sets. I started coon trapping November 9th last year. I did catch a couplke coons while rat trapping on the marsh the 1st week of saeson. These coons, even the big ones, were not near as good as the ones caught on my 1st coon line. 1st week of season we were seeing alot of $5.00 averages coon. My coons caught after Nov. 10th averaged $13.00. Almost triple!! That is pretty impressive you dug 180 pockets in 10 hours!! you had to have been gang setting bridges pretty good because that is 3.33 minutes a set!! I do not know very many if ANY that avg. $5.00 on coon first week? anyone on here tell me if you did? My first week coon avg. $8.75 Also i could be wrong but i think you avg. better on your second week coon than most of the people on this forum, because you are pretty close with groney out there? i do not know to many people that avg. $13 the second week? I think a good assumption would be people avg. $8 first week and maybe $10 second week!! and around the area i trap i know a bunch of guys that actually went down in avg from first week to second week becuase of the market!!!!! I also do not think that coon "PRIME" between the first and second week! I use to pound in 100-150 sets opening morning too...but this year i tried pre-staking and it was so nice not having to BUST my butt so hard the first couple days! I have limited time to trap due to school and work also.... since i pre-staked this year and had my line completly out the first night, and was able to add additional traps to my line becuase i had more time... i caught a couple hundred more coon than the few years before! |
|
|
|
Post by muskrat72 on Feb 25, 2009 23:33:23 GMT -6
I can put in 100 sets a day and thats pounding stakes in unscouted areas. I use wooden stakes and wire everything. Will admit my wire is precut,and next year my wire will be attached to my stakes. But what I want to know is if I come across someone else's stake, that they have put in preseason, can I just attach my trap to their stake? One more thing,BIG-T needs to lay off the sauce!
|
|
|
|
Post by jdrogge on Feb 26, 2009 0:11:13 GMT -6
My 1st week avg on coon was $8 the same thing my buyer was paying up till about thanksgiving. To answer your question T we prestaked for two days before season this year, by 7PM opening night we had over 500 sets operating across 150+ miles, the kicker is we were only able to run hard for about 5 days before we had to pull up. That is where prestaking shines. I enjoy the challenge of pushing myself as hard as I can, If I only have 3 days to trap I'm gonna kick ass as hard as I can for 3 days, that is just me I guess. Next year if there is no prestaking I will push just as hard as before, I might step on a few more toes, but thats gonna be the new lay of the land I guess.
|
|
|
|
Post by k9 on Feb 26, 2009 21:44:38 GMT -6
I do not prestake many snares at all, I do prestake a lot of water sets.
The reason I do not prestake snares is my concern that someone will open one up, and also my ability to slam one in so fast makes it no advantage at all.
In water trapping, I prestake because the majority of my time and energy are exerted on opening day fighting staking. In most locations I can pull up on the bridge and tell you what the staking conditions are going to be, but sometimes that changes a bit from year to year, especially in years of big floods like last year. I prestake all my big water, but very few of my small creeks. My prestaked traps in big water pretty much can't be found by others, where the small creeks make it harder to hide the prestaked trap. In the smaller creeks that I do prestake the trap gets pushed down into the mud, and frankly if you did not see me put it there, you will not know it's there.
I have several stretches of road that I do not prestake at all because several other trappers also set up those roads and I do not want to have my gear in thier way if they get there first.
Ran into Creekman Coon on one such road, and I did no preatking there in the ROW because I know several others hit that road, one buddy of mine sits on it till 8am.
Most of my prestaked stuff is down very steep banks where most of my competition does not want to go, and frankly I do not want to make unneccessary trips to the truck. Some of those spots, the only other guy in this area I have seen with enough gumption to get down there and compete with me, has been Riverrat.
One of these banks is so steep, I slid down it a couple years ago and ended up with a live coon in my crotch when I hit the bottom. You can "butt walk" up a steep bank when a live coon is in your crotch.
In summary I prestake to save energy and time, but only prestake in places that historically I have had no predictable competition from other trappers.
|
|
|
|
Post by Brett H. on Feb 26, 2009 22:14:20 GMT -6
I do not prestake many snares at all, I do prestake a lot of water sets. The reason I do not prestake snares is my concern that someone will open one up, and also my ability to slam one in so fast makes it no advantage at all. In water trapping, I prestake because the majority of my time and energy are exerted on opening day fighting staking. In most locations I can pull up on the bridge and tell you what the staking conditions are going to be, but sometimes that changes a bit from year to year, especially in years of big floods like last year. I prestake all my big water, but very few of my small creeks. My prestaked traps in big water pretty much can't be found by others, where the small creeks make it harder to hide the prestaked trap. In the smaller creeks that I do prestake the trap gets pushed down into the mud, and frankly if you did not see me put it there, you will not know it's there. I have several stretches of road that I do not prestake at all because several other trappers also set up those roads and I do not want to have my gear in thier way if they get there first. Ran into Creekman Coon on one such road, and I did no preatking there in the ROW because I know several others hit that road, one buddy of mine sits on it till 8am. Most of my prestaked stuff is down very steep banks where most of my competition does not want to go, and frankly I do not want to make unneccessary trips to the truck. Some of those spots, the only other guy in this area I have seen with enough gumption to get down there and compete with me, has been Riverrat. One of these banks is so steep, I slid down it a couple years ago and ended up with a live coon in my crotch when I hit the bottom. You can "butt walk" up a steep bank when a live coon is in your crotch. In summary I prestake to save energy and time, but only prestake in places that historically I have had no predictable competition from other trappers. K9 it is a pleasure to trap around you and the other guys around there!....you all are very honest and straight forward about everything! Makes everything that much more enjoyable when i can sleep at night knowing my nothing is going to be messed with! I think i dispatched more coon for you guys this year than i had my own! haha Also this year i had a place pre-staked...as did bruce that i had not known b/c his trap was buried in the mud very well! well anyway when i got around to that trap at about 10AM my trap had been pulled and sat on the bank and his trap was right there and set!! this is a good example of how everyone should do it! HE WAS THERE FIRST AFTER 800 am so he set there! one more.....haha i was out prestaking the weekend before and went down this bank saw a hole in the bank and looked around seen nothing.....well i went to stake my pogo and i hit something...start feeling around...and it was a TRAP it was Bruces about 4 inches down in the mud! |
|
|
|
Post by ~ADC~ on Feb 26, 2009 22:25:14 GMT -6
I agree Brett it sure is nice to know there are so many that can be trusted in our area. This is the first year that I can remember for many that I never lost a trap or animal that I can prove was stolen. It's a bit amazing.
~ADC~
|
|
|
|
Post by Brett H. on Feb 26, 2009 22:37:23 GMT -6
I agree Brett it sure is nice to know there are so many that can be trusted in our area. This is the first year that I can remember for many that I never lost a trap or animal that I can prove was stolen. It's a bit amazing. ~ADC~ I agree 100% I only lost one trap in that area this year and i had no reason to beleive it was a person! On the other hand though i ran another line with only 1/10 the traps over thanksgiving in another area and lost a dozen and i know some of those for sure were people!! It is a blessing to trap around you guys!! I think i prob. have benifited the most because i am young and VERY interested in learning and while trapping around you VERY VERY VERY good trappers, I just watch what you guys do and try to soak it all in and think of your reasonings behind it! I have learned more from you guys about trapping than i could even imagine!! starts with HONESTY AND RESPECT FOR FELLOW TRAPPERS!!  |
|
|
|
Post by Kelly on Feb 26, 2009 22:46:52 GMT -6
If I were to pre-stake it would be for health reasons. Have two very bad knees and a bad lower back(spinal stenosis) that effects my molbility and balance. Have to be so very careful not to fall. Use my tile spade more as a crutch/cane than anything else. Can no longer run, can't kneel at all nor bend over for much more than a couple minutes at a time. Would only pre-stake in water because that is where I only trap. You see, if I really bust my butt can only get about 30-35 sets out in a day. Without prestaking it will take many, many days for me to get a full line out. Also, if I did prestake there is no way that I think a claim has been laid to that exact spot by me. If you get there before I do by all means set my stuff aside/nearby. Or, do what I do and pick another spot nearby. There never is just one perfect spot at a location.
|
|
|
|
Post by dblcoil on Feb 26, 2009 23:15:35 GMT -6
I realize that pre staking saves time on opening day. But for those that pre stake, let me ask you this. Let's say you have 200-300 snares pre staked in ditches on coon trails. Now at 8am on opening day, my partner and I get ahead of you and pound in our snares on the same trails that you are already pre staked on. Since the loops on your snares are not opened yet, it should be fair game for us right? So we go ahead and set up a couple hundred snares in the trails that you already had pre staked (we even set the other side of the road too.) Now when you come along to open your loops, are you honestly going to just pull your gear and happily move on down the road or is there going to be a pissin match? I know guys have said on here before, that when they come upon a deal like this where they have had a trail pre staked and someone else beats them to it on opening day, they simply move to a different location. That may be, but Im sure there are quite a few arguments, etc because the first guy who pre staked the trail automatically thinks that it is his. And Im sure that a lot of guys would not put in set on a trail that is already pre staked by another trapper even though he has the right too because he simply doesnt want the possible confrontation. I dont think pre staking should be allowed. At 8am on opening day, set till your heart's content, that way everyone is on the same playing feild.
|
|
|
|
Post by Brett H. on Feb 26, 2009 23:28:04 GMT -6
I realize that pre staking saves time on opening day. But for those that pre stake, let me ask you this. Let's say you have 200-300 snares pre staked in ditches on coon trails. Now at 8am on opening day, my partner and I get ahead of you and pound in our snares on the same trails that you are already pre staked on. Since the loops on your snares are not opened yet, it should be fair game for us right? So we go ahead and set up a couple hundred snares in the trails that you already had pre staked (we even set the other side of the road too.) Now when you come along to open your loops, are you honestly going to just pull your gear and happily move on down the road or is there going to be a pissin match? I know guys have said on here before, that when they come upon a deal like this where they have had a trail pre staked and someone else beats them to it on opening day, they simply move to a different location. That may be, but Im sure there are quite a few arguments, etc because the first guy who pre staked the trail automatically thinks that it is his. And Im sure that a lot of guys would not put in set on a trail that is already pre staked by another trapper even though he has the right too because he simply doesnt want the possible confrontation. I dont think pre staking should be allowed. At 8am on opening day, set till your heart's content, that way everyone is on the same playing feild. OK, I do not pre-stake snares but was just going to try to answer a few of your questions as i see them! First i dont think you would run the SAME EXACT line as someone!! unless you were trying and just to piss them off...which would be a total diff. case than! Second If someone had there prestaked and you did not... you both leave at 800 am, then i would assume that they would be setting there snares faster then you so could get to a few places before them but they should be going faster and pass you at some point and be ahead of you? follow me? like i said i do not pre-stake snares and do not have much expeirence i am just trying to disscuse thise further!! Also, you said about being on a "same playing field"... well we are you just CHOOSE not to pre-stake...you CAN though!!... just as someone can choose not to trap the first week of season becuase fur is not prime...that does not mean we should push the start date of season back for those people! just my .2 Cents!!.... even further, if someone can not trap a year we should not cancel season to make it FAIR. |
|
|
|
Post by jdrogge on Feb 26, 2009 23:52:23 GMT -6
No pissin match from me, that trail belongs to you just as much as me, but you can bet if the trail is that good it'll be wearing a snare or two of mine also. Some days you'll get the coon some days I'll get the coon, or would that not be acceptable to you, do you automatically think that trail is yours because you set it first?? Water trappers don't piss and moan like that when someone sets under the same bridge as them, I've been under bridges with 3 other guys set up there and nobody thinks they own the location. So why is it if I set a snare on the same trail as you its automatically a pissin match, I think some people are just overly sensitive about competition,
|
|
My 1st day of coon trapping this last season I dug 180 pockets in an 10 hour period. Is 180 sets not enough to put in on opening day?? Day 2 start early and check day one sets and pound in another 120 sets. I started coon trapping November 9th last year. I did catch a couplke coons while rat trapping on the marsh the 1st week of saeson. These coons, even the big ones, were not near as good as the ones caught on my 1st coon line. 1st week of season we were seeing alot of $5.00 averages coon. My coons caught after Nov. 10th averaged $13.00. Almost triple!!
First of I'll be you 20 bucks that you will prestake next year BigT if it is still lawful. Second, everyone remembers you shooting your mouth off about the mink were prime, the coon were all 30# plus, the coon were all prime, blah, blah, blah when season first opened. And we remember how you didn't set coons up because you set rats up that first week. Actually it was about 4 days until you got "froze out" and pulled things. Then you were "so exhausted" you didn't get your coon line out until I had called you every girl name in the book and said you needed to install a tampon machine in your truck. Remember? Nov. 9th. How long did you run that line before you got froze out? Prestaking is probably essential in some years for a good catch in your area. 
